Floating fire extinguisher boxes.

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    • Floating fire extinguisher boxes.

      Throughout the game, there are MANY fire extinguisher boxes that don't contact their walls. Here are many instances early on in the game, including a floating warning bell in bm_c1a0a0010_proc.jpg. Also, the "FIRE EXTINGUSHER" sign is misspelled. It should be "FIRE EXTINGUISHER", which is humorously displayed on the side of the fire extinguisher box.

      I'm not going to report any further fire extinguisher boxes that are floating away from their walls. It appears that this is a widespread EPIDEMIC issue. I've alerted you BMS Devs of a reoccurring issue/trend and assume that you'll search for and address any additional issues/occurrences within the rest of the game. My feedback concerns the first five fire extinguisher boxes encountered in the game, of which NONE contact their walls. It's a very poor 0-for-5 record. Please investigate the rest of the fire extinguisher boxes throughout the game and ensure that none of them are floating.
      Files

      The post was edited 6 times, last by Dadster ().

    • I found these small gaps LONG ago, some of which I have previously reported. At the time, I was reporting this specific issue based on the "BMS mod" version of the game. It's obvious that these issues were never fixed. I'm now reporting these same issues based on the STEAM version of the game, which is supposedly a higher standard of BMS - in some regards, NOT. The public are now paying for the game and I'm hoping that the BMS Devs give a higher priority towards fixing these lingering types of issues, some of which are longstanding and have been previously reported.

      Now that I own the STEAM version of the game, I'll intensely search for and report issues within the game that in my mind need to be reviewed and let the BMS Devs decide what should be fixed. Some of my money is now in the pockets of the BMS Devs. Give me my monies worth.

      The post was edited 4 times, last by Dadster ().

    • Dadster wrote:


      Now that I own the STEAM version of the game, I'll intensely search for and report issues within the game that in my mind need to be reviewed and let the BMS Devs decide what should be fixed. Some of my money is now in the pockets of the BMS Devs. Give me my monies worth.
      Maybe you should create ONE thread for all the things you find. Call it - idk - "Dadster's view on BM" or something. That way, everybody can decide to have a look at ONE thread or not, instead spamming the forum with threads for each find. You can update the OP each time you found somthing, so it will all be easy to find.

      Apart from this, I know how important this is to you. So go ahead, do your thing, but please try to keep it in one thread (my two cents). I've been following the discussions you and text had back in the day. I can already see where this might be heading...

      Also, saying "Give me my monies worth" is something very unsuitable to say in this context. Sounds like you thought you paid for having fire extiguishers moved a few millimeters more to the right. In an action-loaded video game.

      Black Mesa fully supports modding. You are free to take some of the huge amount of time you are taking to find all these things in order to learn how to use hammer and make the objects stop floating yourself. Would be a huge time saver, I think.
      Co-creator of two humans.
    • Dadster wrote:

      I found these small gaps LONG ago, some of which I have previously reported. At the time, I was reporting this specific issue based on the "BMS mod" version of the game. It's obvious that these issues were never fixed. I'm now reporting these same issues based on the STEAM version of the game, which is supposedly a higher standard of BMS - in some regards, NOT. The public are now paying for the game and I'm hoping that the BMS Devs give a higher priority towards fixing these lingering types of issues, some of which are longstanding and have been previously reported.

      Now that I own the STEAM version of the game, I'll intensely search for and report issues within the game that in my mind need to be reviewed and let the BMS Devs decide what should be fixed. Some of my money is now in the pockets of the BMS Devs. Give me my monies worth.
      Firstly, we told you we weren't going to fix those issues. Many times. We have explicitly told you on countless occasions that we will not work on these issues. This is why we do not want you to post them and clutter up the issues that do matter. The fact that these clipping/floating still exist on the retail version should not be a shock, considering you were told we wouldn't fix it about a million times. We made many, many more important and numerous changes than that for the retail release.

      The retail version is undoubtedly to a higher standard, as is our support for it. We put high priorities on fixing issues that exist in our game. Just a quick look at our updates will show you how much stuff we fix. Issues that actually impact players. This stuff here, does not. 0.0001% of players will notice this stuff, and you are that 0.0001%. Literally nobody except you has ever posted these types of issues to us in such volume, and there is a reason for that. We have more important things to deal with. It would be incredibly irresponsible of us to waste our time moving props a few millimeters in whatever direction from every post you've made. That could be time spent towards actually making our game appreciably better in some ways. A tough enough job as it is.

      Importantly - the fact that you own the Steam game doesn't grant you the right to come onto our forums and do whatever you want. If we ask you politely to stop spamming us, that is our right. The fact that you are constantly blatantly disregarding our reasonable requests says a lot. I stress - we appreciate the financial support of every purchaser immensely. We appreciate our customers and fans, and everything in between, immensely. But that's not how it works. You have your money's worth. It's called owning the retail version of Black Mesa, which is what you are paying for. No more, no less. The fact that some of your money is now in our pockets, doesn't mean that we have to entertain this. And again - I stress - we truly appreciate the fact that our fans are happy to put some money in our pockets in exchange for the thing that we made. That truly is a special and wonderful thing and we do not take it for granted. We don't even take it for granted from you! But you weren't paying us to come on our forums and flood us with unimportant issues. You were paying us for our game!

      John asked you nicely when you posted on his wall. I have asked you nicely privately once you started posting stuff like this, and you seem to have ignored me. I am now asking you nicely publicly. Please let this be where this drama ends. As Wayne_Acoba said. Keep it to one "Dadster" thread if you really absolutely can't stop yourself from posting stuff like this. Just know that we do not have time to fix pretty much any of that stuff, and if you post 90% issues we don't care about, it makes it much harder for us to find and fix the 10% of issues you post that we might actually care about and consider fixing. Of which there is already at least 1!
      Chon Kemp - Lead Level Designer and Community Manager
      Creator of the Black Mesa "Uncut" Mods - Surface Tension Uncut and On a Rail Uncut
      My dev blog on the development of dm_gasworks
    • No Dadster. My message TO YOU AND ONLY YOU is to stop posting these things. Or to do so in a single thread of your own, using large posts, so you don't constantly clutter up the forum feeds with your own issues that nobody else cares about. I've written nothing about our BMS retail customers other than we value them and want to make our game awesome in significant ways for them.

      You and I clearly have a very different definition of "respect". I seem to recall you only stopped grudgingly after we had about 5 seperate arguments, and the BM devs banned you twice; given that this was before I was on the team. You didn't "respect" anything or anyone here, otherwise you wouldn't still be here arguing with me and doing the same thing today, after being asked to stop by 2 different devs, politely every time. You clearly don't respect us, considering this is about the 6th time you've just blatantly disregarded the word of the TEAM YOU ARE SUPPOSEDLY TRYING TO HELP. We keep telling you "this isn't helpful and is actively harmful". At what point do you actually listen to the people you're trying to help? Are you even trying to help us? Why are you doing this? Can you see where my confusion might arise here?

      I'm trying to be patient with you here because you are trying to post feedback and we value people who care about the game enough to try and help improve it.Particularly given that you have a great attention to detail that could be put to excellent use when used in the right way. This isn't how to do it. We have had this discussion too many times, it's getting pretty sad. Please don't make me take action.
      Chon Kemp - Lead Level Designer and Community Manager
      Creator of the Black Mesa "Uncut" Mods - Surface Tension Uncut and On a Rail Uncut
      My dev blog on the development of dm_gasworks
    • Hi Dadster,

      Whilst I appreciate the dedication you have to these very minor issues, it is my job to prioritise bugs for fixing. We don't have a vast amount of development time available to spend re aligning props, we have Xen to finish and larger more important bugs such as crashes and save file errors to debug and fix. Currently the team is focused on creating content, and we have 2 dedicated people to deal with level design and non code related bugs, one of which is me (amongst other things).

      Adding multiple threads is not helpful, it fills the forum up and then more important threads are pushed down.

      Most of these bugs are purely visual and would be prioritised to the lowest level there is, and certainly will not be fixed before the launch of xen, and depending on severity would not be fixed after.

      If you persist in ignoring this advice, you will be removed from the forum, and your threads merged and archived. That is all there is to say on this topic.

      Thank you for your time.

      Lead Level Designer / Game Designer / ARG Designer / Bug Fixer / Programmer Annoyer / 4th Wall Breaker / Xen Plan Writer (paperplansarecool)
    • That's not the point Text was trying to make, Dadster. The point he was making was that there are more important issues to find in Black Mesa than an object not properly connected.

      For example, I once reported a bug in the final map of the game where you couldn't hear the scientist giving you the ok to go through the portal. It has been fixed since then.
    • Dadster wrote:

      So the message to your BMS retail customers is to ignore the MANY basic issues that still exist within the recent version of the game, as stated with the issues above? I've respected your long-term request to not contact/comment on your BMS mods. But the negative attitude towards fixing these basic issues makes no senseI
      I´m a customer and you know what? If CC would waste time fixing something that isn´t broken instead of developing that X-thingy that we´re all waiting for, I´d probably ask my money back. What was it again, "Xanadu"?

      Anyway, I have a solution for your... problem: You know that Hammer that was shipped with Black Mesa? And those vmf´s? With them you can start fixing these "bugs" that you keep finding. And then by the time you´ve fixed every single thing from every corner of every map maybe, just maybe, you´ll realise how utterly pointless and time-consuming that was and that you could´ve been using your time to something meaningful. Food for thought, yeah?
    • Hi. Having done quite a bit of work with BM's assets, I too noticed these issues. The problem is that the models' geometry relative to the origin is ever so slightly off the mark with Hammer's grid points. Any designer who ever uses the props would notice it. However, I - like the LDs over at CC - knew that 98% of players wouldn't notice, 1% might but wouldn't care, and then there's guys like you who expect perfection. Developers rarely cater to that 1%, Dadster. Because it's a lot of work to be perfect, and if it's not one thing, it will always be another.

      It's not that they're ignoring a basic issue. The back of the dam wall in ST was a basic issue. It's that developers know when to say "fuck it," and let imperfections slip because it's just not worth it to them to fix it, no matter how quick and easy or hard and difficult to fix. Especially if they've got a deadline. It's not laziness or ignoring basics (I could detail why this isn't basic as well but it's not important at this point), or showing a lack of care for fans, it's just allowing a slight imperfection that's only noticeable in certain conditions and under close scrutiny. Developers of all sorts do it all the time because again, that 1% of players isn't a big deal because they can't be pleased anyway.

      Also trust me, trying to be perfect is a slippery freakin' slope, as a dev. You start off opening Hammer to fix a minuscule imperfection in 2 minutes and suddenly you're spending 6 hours reworking stuff that only matters to the 1%.
      And so ends another post of pointless speculation.

      "120% sorry!"

      The post was edited 1 time, last by Crypt ().

    • Crypt wrote:

      Hi. Having done quite a bit of work with BM's assets, I too noticed these issues. The problem is that the models' geometry relative to the origin is ever so slightly off the mark with Hammer's grid points. Any designer who ever uses the props would notice it. However, I - like the LDs over at CC - knew that 98% of players wouldn't notice, 1% might but wouldn't care, and then there's guys like you who expect perfection. Developers rarely cater to that 1%, Dadster. Because it's a lot of work to be perfect, and if it's not one thing, it will always be another.

      It's not that they're ignoring a basic issue. The back of the dam wall in ST was a basic issue. It's that developers know when to say "fuck it," and let imperfections slip because it's just not worth it to them to fix it, no matter how quick and easy or hard and difficult to fix. Especially if they've got a deadline. It's not laziness or ignoring basics (I could detail why this isn't basic as well but it's not important at this point), or showing a lack of care for fans, it's just allowing a slight imperfection that's only noticeable in certain conditions and under close scrutiny. Developers of all sorts do it all the time because again, that 1% of players isn't a big deal because they can't be pleased anyway.

      Also trust me, trying to be perfect is a slippery freakin' slope, as a dev. You start off opening Hammer to fix a minuscule imperfection in 2 minutes and suddenly you're spending 6 hours reworking stuff that only matters to the 1%.
      So clip the fire extinguisher boxes into the wall by a little bit, which I suspect has been done by some of the level makers because not all them are floating off of their respective walls, or maybe they made more of an effort to position them properly.

      The post was edited 1 time, last by Dadster ().

    • Kaltsu wrote:

      Would you have noticed any of these small gaps that you reported unless you weren't looking for them?
      WHAT ? . . . . . As a dedicated game/mod supporter/member, I'm looking for ALL issues, always. I'm not only a player, but a fixer too!

      One can understand that the early part of the BMS Devs focused on fixing the major issues within BMS. My assumption was that at a far later date that the Devs would return to tidy up and fix the reported residual finer details within BMS that still needed fixing. Obviously, it's up to the Devs whether or not these residual issues need to be fixed, and when.

      This is why I reported some of the same issues again, to bring them to the attention of the BMS Devs for correction before their next release. Let me know if you want me to advise you of any more other issues that need fixing.

      The post was edited 2 times, last by Dadster ().